Author Topic: Fire Pelini  (Read 97353 times)

Offline gbs20

  • Humboldt Penguin
  • **
  • Posts: 62
    • View Profile
Re: Fire Pelini
« Reply #45 on: November 03, 2019, 08:01:18 AM »
True. But what has that got them? And I would bet that they are complaining that they arent getting enough to compete. 

Salary increases the chances of success but it doesnt equate to success.  It takes hard work to recruit good coaches just as it does to recruit good players.  And you have to have something to offer them. 

YSU was turned down by multiple coaches before they hired Bolden who was motivated and built the womens basketball program that was at a point far below where football is now.  Now its self sustaining. 

FInd a young D2 or D3 coach who is ambitious and dont use ties to Youngstown as a criteria.  Tressel didnt have ties to Youngstown before he got here and neither did most of his assistants.  Its no guarantee   but clearly past approaches havent worked.

Offline guinpen

  • Global Moderator
  • Emperor Penguin
  • *****
  • Posts: 4321
    • View Profile
Re: Fire Pelini
« Reply #46 on: November 03, 2019, 08:13:06 AM »

 not only do you have to be a good recruiter of players, but you must also be a good recruiter of coaches, especially when you have limited resources. This means the Pelini has to find good up-and-coming coaches that are good recruiters, good coaches, and will work for less to have the opportunities.


Agreed, at our level this will apply to any head coach. JT did a good job with this.

AD needs to find that diamond in the ruff HC, an up and comer. The guy that other schools will be luring away from us after he proves how good he is. This will not be easy but that is the job of the AD. And when you can see you made a bad pick, know when to start looking again.
“Life is hard, it’s harder if you're stupid” - John Wayne

Offline penguinpower

  • Emperor Penguin
  • *****
  • Posts: 2880
    • View Profile
Re: Fire Pelini
« Reply #47 on: November 03, 2019, 08:21:15 AM »
With respect, I cant buy the resources argument.  The stadium and WATTS are top tier especially compared to other FCS programs. The university environment is the best its been.  Its on Pelini to find and young hire up and comers from the coaching ranks. Money isnt the issue, its having a good set up on the career ladder. They also have to want to work for him.  We've seen his personality. What does he have to offer to an aspiring coach?  Maybe the only ones who will work for him are the cronies.  It cant be harder to recruit to Youngstown than the Dakotas and Iowa and middle of Illinois.  Its not expensive to recruit Toledo, Columbus, Cincinnati and Cleveland not be mention Western PA. There is competition for talent everywhere. The idea was that players would come here because of Pelini. Maybe they arent coming here because of Pelini.

His personality has nothing to do with it.  If he can promise a true shot at the NFL, he will get the talent he needs.  Pelini is not the only recruiter.  "You win with people"-Someone close to the university said that years ago.  The issue is that you need to recruit the talent required to win.  Winning allows you to get even more talent.  Talent enables you win games against good teams.  Talent allows you to play a non-perfect game and win because talent helps you to cover up mistakes.  Real talent works to eliminate mistakes. 

If there is a real shot at getting a good look from the NFL with Pelini's NFL ties then it would be worth keeping him, but he needs a good staff surrounding him and he doesn't have it.  If we continue to lose, it will be even more difficult to recruit.  NDSU has a national recruiting footprint.  We do not.  Did you see their roster?  They have kids from Florida and California...from all over.  We do not have that level of diversity nor do we have that sort of recruiting presence.  They don't even have a freaking stadium.  They rent the Fargo Dome, they have outdoor football fields not an indoor practice facility.  They have money because they have a fan base that puts more than 5k people in the stands.  They have boosters and they pay more to their coaches.  They have a recruiting strategy that is outstanding.   We have a coach that doesn't care to recruit and then has assistants, some of which are unqualified, to land recruits.  Pelini has to do it all himself.  I always use D'Alesio as an example because he is easy to point out as the example......but there is no way I would go and play for D'Alesio.  NO FREAKING WAY.  Pelini would have to come to my house.  Now if it was NDSU and I knew that they win all of the time....maybe I would sign on and play for one of their assistants.  I don't think we have that kind of continuity or program.  Do we even have a program or do we just randomly get whatever we can when it comes to player personnel?
« Last Edit: November 03, 2019, 08:23:09 AM by penguinpower »

Offline penguinpower

  • Emperor Penguin
  • *****
  • Posts: 2880
    • View Profile
Re: Fire Pelini
« Reply #48 on: November 03, 2019, 08:30:18 AM »
True. But what has that got them? And I would bet that they are complaining that they arent getting enough to compete. 

Salary increases the chances of success but it doesnt equate to success.  It takes hard work to recruit good coaches just as it does to recruit good players.  And you have to have something to offer them. 

YSU was turned down by multiple coaches before they hired Bolden who was motivated and built the womens basketball program that was at a point far below where football is now.  Now its self sustaining. 

FInd a young D2 or D3 coach who is ambitious and dont use ties to Youngstown as a criteria.  Tressel didnt have ties to Youngstown before he got here and neither did most of his assistants.  Its no guarantee   but clearly past approaches havent worked.

YSU was turned down by other coaches because we don't resource the coaches to be successful.  They wanted more money, we cannot afford it.  I know that some people on this board think $100k is a lot of money but outside of the Mahoning Valley that is not a lot of money.  It is peanuts in comparison to what other schools pay.  Talent can go somewhere else for more money and talent WILL do that.

We need some sort of SWOT analysis done for each sport and then use that SWOT to find the right coach and have a plan to leverage strengths, address weaknesses, aggressively pursue opportunities, and eliminate threats. 
« Last Edit: November 03, 2019, 08:36:04 AM by penguinpower »

Offline FOOTBALLFEVER

  • Emperor Penguin
  • *****
  • Posts: 980
    • View Profile
Re: Fire Pelini
« Reply #49 on: November 03, 2019, 08:43:12 AM »
https://www.inforum.com/bison-media-zone/mens-sports/football/4752459-McFeely-Pelini-is-blunt-as-always-but-what-else-can-he-say This should have been a trap game and much closer game for the Bison, considering our win last week and their hard fought contest only having to go on the road and face a Pelini squad that historically plays them close. Instead it looked like they never lost their 25 seniors from a year ago and were the home team inside the Fargo dome. On the bright side of things our next two opponents are very bad. Western beat South Dakota yesterday and South Dakota shut out Indiana St earlier in the year. It will be interesting to see how this team responds on the road

Offline YSU1

  • Emperor Penguin
  • *****
  • Posts: 694
    • View Profile
Re: Fire Pelini
« Reply #50 on: November 03, 2019, 09:39:05 AM »
this problem did not just start now.  3 play-off appearances in the last 20 years is not good.  each year more and more fans find other things to do on saturdays.  whatever the problems are, money, recruiting, coaching there is no easy fix.  for the hard core loyal YSU followers it is a hard pill to swallow.   

Offline FOOTBALLFEVER

  • Emperor Penguin
  • *****
  • Posts: 980
    • View Profile
Re: Fire Pelini
« Reply #51 on: November 03, 2019, 10:05:33 AM »
Bottom line is this team should not be 8-13 in conference play after a National title run in 2016
« Last Edit: November 03, 2019, 10:13:38 AM by FOOTBALLFEVER »

Offline dwj

  • King Penguin
  • ****
  • Posts: 288
    • View Profile
Re: Fire Pelini
« Reply #52 on: November 03, 2019, 10:43:19 AM »
My concern is that he Pi$$es  away Waid's red shirt on 3 meaningless games.  If he does this he should be fired at seasons end.  Poor planning and player management.

Offline goodnews

  • Emperor Penguin
  • *****
  • Posts: 957
    • View Profile
Re: Fire Pelini
« Reply #53 on: November 03, 2019, 11:22:21 AM »
I would be more concerned what happens the next 3 weeks off the gield with recruiting.  In addition, if Waid is the guy Craycraft may bolt causing more problems.  Like I said nothing is a quick fix and we are spiralling down in so many ways.

Offline IAA Fan

  • Administrator
  • Emperor Penguin
  • *****
  • Posts: 12051
  • Bring Coke back to YSU!!
    • View Profile
    • ysupenguins.com
Re: Fire Pelini
« Reply #54 on: November 03, 2019, 01:18:30 PM »
Look: NDSU's recruiting base has grown, but they still have 72 of their 99 players from 4 states (HD, SD, Minn and IL). However, we have to realize that NDSU looks for a very specific kind of player, as we used to. Frankly, I thought their defense was noticeably weaker than year past last night.  Funny how they got the the kid who is probably the best (or second best) punter in Ohio & we did not. Why is that? That is not forgivable unless he is a legacy or something.

Now we can spend the money to move into NDSU territory and recruit, but why? Outside of Illinois (which we should be all over) we would be lucky to take any recruits away from NDSU. Those same dollars would yield 10+ recruits from Florida, or some quality California JUCO's.

The difference is that our staff does not know "what" to recruit, as they have no idea what talent is & this team has no real coordinators to give it direction (Carl excluded). They have no idea that you have to know your needs before you recruit, not just grab some transfer because he is available. Right now I have no idea what this team needs. We simply need an upgrade at all positions (which is truly a sign of bad staff).  Here is an example: about 5 years ago we had YSU great Jamaine Cook at TB (arguably the best back in I-AA). An incredible package of power and speed. His back-ups were Demond Hymes, Martin Ruiz and Jody Webb. Hymes had real ability and a local kid that we all liked; yet we all knew he was never going to be Cook. A year later we had the "thunder and lightning tandem of Martin Ruiz and Jody Webb ... undoubtedly the most effective tandem in the nation. Their back-ups were Tevin McCaster and Joe Allesi. Tevin had the power & Alessi had some speed, but we all knew that neither of them had what Martin Ruiz had in vision, power and speed. And Webb was simply a true 4.4 bolt of lightning with dynamic vision. McCaster was a full back and served a purpose. Over the past couple of years, these career back-ups have become our starters. How did that happen? Simple, we failed to continue to recruit. If any of you have time and care to do so, take a look at this year's o-line and then line up the past 2 seasons of the same. You will see that we lost everyone, even sophs and juniors? What happened to them? They left and were not replaced with the same talent level. Our line (except Zinni) are all first-year guys

Look at our level a team cannot be everything, as we do not have all of the scholarships. On offense you need to decide if you a running team that can pass ... or a passing team that can run. On defense you have to stop the run & force your opposition to throw at you ... or be a passing-covering team and force your opponents to play power ball against you. Tressel's DC was Heacock. He shut down our opponents run game (with lines that were big, strong and deep), backed them up with LB's and dared teams to pass against usually 1 or two stop-dead backs in the secondary. He then worked his middle. Everyone loved to watch it & how we became the master (if not inventors) of smash-mouth football. On offense, Tressel established the run at any cost (which included more than a few losses). His lines were big, fast and deep. Again, this year we start only 1 player up front that has seen a previous start in a YSU uniform, yet they are all seniors.
« Last Edit: November 04, 2019, 07:46:04 AM by IAA Fan »

Offline YSUGO

  • Global Moderator
  • Emperor Penguin
  • *****
  • Posts: 3438
    • View Profile
Re: Fire Pelini
« Reply #55 on: November 03, 2019, 01:45:07 PM »
The program is a mess. Penguinpower is correct.  We are trying to run a program on a dollar general budget.  Hell. Monty might be making more as the OC wherever he is at than Pelini.  The stadium is UTD.  The dollar general press box add on did little to add money to the program.  Look at James Madison’s stadium look at others they needed to
Add Club boxes to buy booze.  Etc.  We are so way over our heads in this conference with the top teams it’s scarey.  Sorry typing this while traveling. 
A Penguin for life!!!

Offline ytownchief22

  • Emperor Penguin
  • *****
  • Posts: 2676
    • View Profile
Re: Fire Pelini
« Reply #56 on: November 03, 2019, 02:41:56 PM »
We are who we are. An average to maybe above average FCS program besides one year where everything aligned with Wolf's good recruiting and Bo's transfers. This team will never get back to what it was in the 90's and people need to realize that. Bo is just buying time until he gets his big time D1 D-Coordinator job or back to the NFL as an assistant coach.

Offline gbs20

  • Humboldt Penguin
  • **
  • Posts: 62
    • View Profile
Re: Fire Pelini
« Reply #57 on: November 04, 2019, 10:39:59 AM »
Wont claim to be inside....but here are some questions, not to answer,  but should be asked by those in charge...

1. Is it a reasonable goal for YSU football to be in the top 4 of the MVFC, be a regular participant in the playoffs, and to occassionally make a deep playoff run?

2. If yes, is YSU achieving that goal?

3. If no, what is preventing YSU from achieving that goal?

4. If no, can the factors preventing YSU from achieving that goal be fixed?

5. If no to #4, should YSU either accept where it is in FCS or drop down to D2?

Offline Wick250

  • Emperor Penguin
  • *****
  • Posts: 2543
    • View Profile
Re: Fire Pelini
« Reply #58 on: November 04, 2019, 11:58:30 AM »
We are all disgusted, and with good reason.  But let's look at this dilemma rationally.  A few other FCS programs have newer and better stadiums, but does anybody else have the facilities package that we can offer?  The stadium, the Watts, a weight room that is equal to any big time program.  The infrastructure for success is in place; the failure is entirely human.

As Penguinpower suggested, the allocation of resources here at YSU is a joke.  Hundreds of thousands squandered on unnecessary athletic administrators while coaches of the revenue programs are underpaid.  Totally unacceptable. 

To answer your questions gbs20, a fresh well-paid head coach with a well-paid staff could return this program to prominence.  But do the power-holders (president and trustees) have the will and the guts to break with the status quo?  At this point, I doubt it.

Offline Double ET

  • Emperor Penguin
  • *****
  • Posts: 1850
    • View Profile
Re: Fire Pelini
« Reply #59 on: November 04, 2019, 05:34:34 PM »
Been a season ticket holder since 83. Done. Will tailgate to have fun. Will not go into another game until the Mooney faction is gone. I’m done.
As I posted after the SIU game....I am done being a season ticket holder ( I have been watching YSU since 1966, my freshman year at the university.