Author Topic: EMU faculty, students: Drop out of Division I football  (Read 12670 times)

Offline DoubleE

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EMU faculty, students: Drop out of Division I football
« on: April 25, 2016, 07:29:26 PM »
http://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/2016/04/25/emu-faculty-students-drop-out-division-football/83493156/

Eastern Michigan University should drop out of Division I football and find a different league for its other sports, all in order to save students money, a new report issued by the university's faculty and students says.

"Culturally and geographically, EMU football will simply never succeed from an attendance and financial standpoint," faculty member Howard Bunsis, who helped prepare the report, said in a presentation to the Board of Regents on Friday. "It is a losing proposition – always has been, and always will be. We hardly raise any money for football, and our attendance is the lowest in the country. Some of you believe that we are close to succeeding, if we just throw more money at the situation. This proposition is insane.

"This has nothing to do with our performance on the field, or the quality of our coaches. Our coaches are good people and dedicated professionals. They are fighting a losing battle that cannot be won. Each and every one of you needs to reassess why you are here; if you have any sense of what is right for EMU, you will drop EMU from Division I football as soon as possible. How can you sit there and justify throwing millions of dollars away?"

Getting rid of Division I football is a moral imperative – it will save students money and lower student debt, the report said. The report also found that each student paid $917 out of pocket to support athletics at Eastern. "Should the university be saddling students with unnecessary debt for athletics programs that added little to no value to their education?" the report says.

The answer, at least according to the faculty and student government, is no. But the report doesn't argue for Eastern to completely withdraw from sports.

"The option of EMU dropping sports completely is not one that we support," the report says. "Though athletics is a significant drain on resources, and increases tuition for students and their families, the loss of tuition revenue from students in the non-revenue sports could hurt EMU financially, and moves us away from important values of teamwork, discipline, and community.

The study was commissioned and conducted by the faculty union and the student government. The 30-page report analyzed historical and current budget figures from the university.

The report is the latest discussion point in a rekindling of a long-simmering dispute over how much Eastern's general fund for pays for sports. The topic made national news last week when HBO's Real Sports featured Eastern in a segment on athletic departments "arms race."

Instead, the report has a different suggestion.

Division I is now split into two divisions – Football Bowl Subdivision (where EMU is) and Football Championship Subdivision (the next step down). The report supports dropping out completely from Division I

"Eastern Michigan should drop Division I football, and join the Horizon League, where football is not required," the report says. "Alternatively, EMU can still play football, but at the Division II or Division III (non-scholarship) level within the Horizon League, which would save even more resources. The advantage of joining the Horizon League is EMU athletes could still compete at the Division I level in Olympic and other non-revenue sports, but spend much less."

There are no active discussions about cutting football, Eastern board chairman Mike Morris has said.

"... there is no active plan among the Board of Regents to specifically evaluate football. On an overall level, the Board has high regard for our current football program, its outstanding coach and its success going forward. We expect to have a great season in 2016," he said last week in a statement.

EMU, like all but a few universities in the nation, doesn't make enough money from athletics to cover its costs. So it sends the department a subsidy from the general fund, which is largely made up of student tuition and state aid. The athletic department spent $33.9 million in the 2014-15 school year, according to data collected by USA TODAY and published earlier this week. Of that amount, more than $27 million, or 80%, came from institutional support. That percentage is the highest in EMU's league, the Mid-American Conference.

The report suggests that the university consider joining a different league to cut costs but still offer athletics.

"A broader discussion should take place on campus on the role of athletics at EMU and whether it would be beneficial to consider moving EMU out of the MAC (Mid-American Conference) and into another league, such as the Horizon League (with Oakland University, etc.), that do not require fielding the most expensive team sports to be members."

The faculty/student government report says athletic spending at Eastern has increased over the past 10 years from around $20 million in 2005 to more than $33 million in 2015, an increase of over 65%.  During the same time period, athletic revenues have declined from around $10 million to almost $7 million.

But while the university is looking carefully at its spending in all areas, there are no plans nor discussions ongoing about cutting that subsidy Morris told the Free Press last week. However, another board member – Jim Stapleton – said he believes there needs to be serious discussions about cutting sports.

Eastern's administration backed Morris' train of thought in a statement posted to its website: "Participating in Division 1 athletics is a substantial financial investment – not only at Eastern, but also at every university that offers a Division 1 program. It is an investment we are committed to because of the benefits athletics provides our institution and students. At the same time, the university is committed to an ongoing evaluation of the best possible use of resources in all operating areas, including athletics."

The statement noted that athletics spending represents less than 8% of the current budget. Athletes make up less than 3% of the student body.

Offline Penguin Nation

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Re: EMU faculty, students: Drop out of Division I football
« Reply #1 on: April 25, 2016, 09:15:16 PM »
"Eastern Michigan should drop Division I football, and join the Horizon League, where football is not required," the report says. "Alternatively, EMU can still play football, but at the Division II or Division III (non-scholarship) level within the Horizon League, which would save even more resources. The advantage of joining the Horizon League is EMU athletes could still compete at the Division I level in Olympic and other non-revenue sports, but spend much less."

Isn't that a violation of the absurd Dayton Rule?
"These two cats that we played against from Youngstown State were as good of pass rushers as I've seen"

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Offline YSUGO

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Re: EMU faculty, students: Drop out of Division I football
« Reply #2 on: April 25, 2016, 09:43:00 PM »
They would have to be FCS in football to be D1 in Basketball.
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Offline IAA Fan

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Re: EMU faculty, students: Drop out of Division I football
« Reply #3 on: April 25, 2016, 10:00:41 PM »
Correct. Obviously written by people with no knowledge. You must be the same level in all sports, unless they want to go NAIA or make football a club sport. As we all know non-scholarship DI is out there, but they should further note that the NCAA does not like it and both of the non-scholarship conferences have gone partial.

In fact, this is why we need to be all over RMU and Duquesne to keep on our schedule. Nice close games.

Offline Wick250

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Re: EMU faculty, students: Drop out of Division I football
« Reply #4 on: April 25, 2016, 11:48:55 PM »
EMU might be shocked to discover that the Horizon League would not take them.  I doubt that Oakland and Detroit want another competitor in their backyard. 

The obscene amount of student debt with which college graduates are burdened might just be the catalyst that will force many of the "make believe" FBS schools to turn to FCS or no football at all.  As Nation and others have noted many times, the status quo is not sustainable.

Offline Penguin Nation

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Re: EMU faculty, students: Drop out of Division I football
« Reply #5 on: April 26, 2016, 11:10:29 AM »
EMU might be shocked to discover that the Horizon League would not take them.  I doubt that Oakland and Detroit want another competitor in their backyard. 

The obscene amount of student debt with which college graduates are burdened might just be the catalyst that will force many of the "make believe" FBS schools to turn to FCS or no football at all.  As Nation and others have noted many times, the status quo is not sustainable.

The competitor (EMU) would be downgrading to a lower RPI conference, and be less appealing to potential recruits.  It would bring EMU down to OU and UDM's level, and erase their recruiting advantage.  I would think OU, who was the Vegas 16 runner-up, would have then have the strongest mid-major recruiting advantage in that region.

Geographically, I think EMU fits the HL like a glove.  I think the HL would love a higher attendance and greater local interest in the HL tournament now held annually in Detroit.  Also, he HL has made clear its desire to dominate the Detroit media market. IMO, EMU, UDM and OU would be analogous to Kent, Akron, and YSU in the OVC days...the greatest rivalry games YSU FB has ever seen.

From reading HL forums, it is my understanding that the HL is very interested in further expansion.

Regarding FB, the only conference that makes sense is the MVFC, except EMU (1-11/0-8) would be upgrading conferences (based on Sagarin and Massey ratings) and likely be further demoralized with ~3-5 conference records....or worse as they would lose 23 schollies and lose the allure to recruits of playing for a faux-FBS program.

If I were the AD or president of EMU, I would lobby similarly situated MAC programs also in dire financial straights, and try to either move the entire MAC to FCS or gather enough MAC schools to form a conference, and invite YSU to it.  Why should these struggling MAC programs resist the inevitable? The NEC and Big South only each have 7 teams, so could this new conference.

It could look somethings like this:

EMU
Akron
Kent
YSU
Miami (OH)
Ball State
Ohio U

If you get Ball State, I wouldn't be surprised if ISUb wouldn't be lured in.

Just thinking about such a conference gets me fired up.  With less conference games, you could play more $$ games.  Such a conference would be a win for the fans, the students...everyone except the MAC and MVFC commissioners.  #ByeFelicia


« Last Edit: April 26, 2016, 11:15:17 AM by Penguin Nation »
"These two cats that we played against from Youngstown State were as good of pass rushers as I've seen"

--WVU Head Coach Dana Holgorsen

Offline ysuguins4

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Re: EMU faculty, students: Drop out of Division I football
« Reply #6 on: April 26, 2016, 12:15:18 PM »
Check out that USA Today report that's mentioned in this article.  With student debt rising and state support decreasing, there's no way these universities will be able to continue to ask the students to fund the majority of the athletic department.



Offline go guins

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Re: EMU faculty, students: Drop out of Division I football
« Reply #7 on: April 26, 2016, 02:02:29 PM »
"It could look somethings like this:

EMU
Akron
Kent
YSU
Miami (OH)
Ball State
Ohio U

If you get Ball State, I wouldn't be surprised if ISUb wouldn't be lured in.

Just thinking about such a conference gets me fired up.  With less conference games, you could play more $$ games.  Such a conference would be a win for the fans, the students...everyone except the MAC and MVFC commissioners.  #ByeFelicia"

Don't get too fired up just yet.  You need several more schools and if you played this schedule today, YSU wouldn't be favored in a single game.  Any your $$$ game scenario is completely bogus.  Who would you play without the BIG and without the MAC, who’s left and why don’t you play them now instead of Dayton, etc.? 

IMO this whole blog should be focused on winning football and sports a lot more and how to make money at small college athletics a lot less (particularly since it is impossible to make money at small college athletics!)
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Offline Penguin Nation

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Re: EMU faculty, students: Drop out of Division I football
« Reply #8 on: April 26, 2016, 03:30:57 PM »
YSU wouldn't be favored in a single game.  Any your $$$ game scenario is completely bogus.  Who would you play without the BIG and without the MAC, who’s left and why don’t you play them now instead of Dayton, etc.? 

YSU's Massey rating is 119, which is higher than Buffalo (120), U Mass (129), Ball State (130), Kent(138), Miami (OH) (140), and wayyy higher than EMU at 177.....and that's after a losing season breaking in a new HC.

Of the list I provided, the only schools that would be favored over YSU would be Ohio U and Akron (barely...and they had an unusually good year in 2015)

As I said, a move from the MAC to the MVFC is an upgrade, the likes of which I'm not sure EMU can handle.  They may very well be another Misery State.
"These two cats that we played against from Youngstown State were as good of pass rushers as I've seen"

--WVU Head Coach Dana Holgorsen

Offline IAA Fan

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Re: EMU faculty, students: Drop out of Division I football
« Reply #9 on: April 26, 2016, 04:27:02 PM »
Missouri Sate is exactly what we want to be, outside of football. Lady Bears Basketball:

NCAA Tourney: 1991, 1992, 1993, 1994, 1995, 1996, 1998, 1999, 2000, 2001, 2003, 2004, 2006 ...with 3 final-4 appearances.

WNIT: 2002, 2005, 2011, 2012, 2015 (2005 Champions)

During that same time the Bears MBB have had zero NCAA appearances, 6 NIT and 2 CIT. nothing but CIT since 2010.


This will get us into almost any conference we want. It will be hard for us to get football back up, but the truth is that if we want to perform well in women's sports (which can be done for a lot less $$$ than comparable men's sports) we have to prioritize out monies ...which is exactly what has been going on
« Last Edit: April 26, 2016, 05:26:14 PM by IAA Fan »

Online guinpen

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Re: EMU faculty, students: Drop out of Division I football
« Reply #10 on: April 26, 2016, 08:42:42 PM »
Missouri Sate is exactly what we want to be, outside of football. Lady Bears Basketball:

Do you really mean this as it sounds? Because it sounds like MBB should just be an after thought. Nothing against WBB, which I love, but I want and expect every sport at YSU to excel men or womens.

“Life is hard, it’s harder if you're stupid” - John Wayne

Offline The YO Show

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Re: EMU faculty, students: Drop out of Division I football
« Reply #11 on: April 26, 2016, 09:24:07 PM »
Missouri Sate is exactly what we want to be, outside of football. Lady Bears Basketball:
I want and expect every sport at YSU to excel men or womens.

I think we all want every sport at YSU to excel.

Offline DoubleE

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Re: EMU faculty, students: Drop out of Division I football
« Reply #12 on: April 26, 2016, 11:18:49 PM »
I would think EMU football in an effort to be non or partial scholarship would be Pioneer or NEC for football and Horizon for other sports

I could see in the near future NDSU and Northern Iowa taking Akron and EMU spots in the MAC as they come down to the Horizion league but who knows

Offline The YO Show

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Re: EMU faculty, students: Drop out of Division I football
« Reply #13 on: April 27, 2016, 05:43:21 AM »
That would be a good plan for EMU I think DoubleE. However, their administration seems to be putting the position that they will never leave the MAC and will keep the status quo.

Offline IAA Fan

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Re: EMU faculty, students: Drop out of Division I football
« Reply #14 on: April 27, 2016, 07:50:07 AM »
Missouri Sate is exactly what we want to be, outside of football. Lady Bears Basketball:

Do you really mean this as it sounds? Because it sounds like MBB should just be an after thought. Nothing against WBB, which I love, but I want and expect every sport at YSU to excel men or womens.

So do I wish to see every sport excel Guinpen, but the truth is the monies are not there & YSU's focus has been women's sports. Also, Nation likes to make fun of SMS, so I thought I would point out their strength is in other sports besides FB and MBB. Now you factor in our desire to not only participate in FB, but excel, we have an even harder task.

So when you are asking if Strollo and the administration know about the performance of other sports (i.e.: MBB) the answer is clearly "yes" and the focus has been placed in other sports.

Look, women's sports today (2016) are like men's sports were decades ago; that is a school can get much more "bang for the their bucks". Many female athletes are happy to get even the slightest bit of scholarship and the teams are smaller. Good football and MBB players do not come so cheap. Facility & staff expenses are much greater in men's sports. We need to stop thinking our staff and administration are incompetent and understand that they are doing what they need to do and deserve our support.