Author Topic: NDSU a Top 25 team?  (Read 27088 times)

Offline guinpen

  • Global Moderator
  • Emperor Penguin
  • *****
  • Posts: 4171
    • View Profile
Re: NDSU a Top 25 team?
« Reply #30 on: September 19, 2016, 09:39:21 PM »
So... what we should just lose and take the money  :-\?

Sounds kinda rough and to the point but if you want the big money to continue long term - yes.

Any big time 1A school that loses to a 1AA school does not belong in the play-offs, period.

Any 1AA school that loses to a D2 does not belong in the play-offs, period.

YSU paid the price for even playing D2 schools by not getting into the play-offs. So we now play the little sisters of 1AA. No different then what the big 10 now does, replaced 1AA teams with their little sisters of 1A aka mac type schools.
“Life is hard, it’s harder if you're stupid” - John Wayne

Offline The YO Show

  • Emperor Penguin
  • *****
  • Posts: 1319
    • View Profile
Re: NDSU a Top 25 team?
« Reply #31 on: September 20, 2016, 07:25:32 AM »
Thank you IAA and guinpen for the clarification. Also, no hard feelings IAA. I am human and do possess an ego, so it is possible at times my personality comes through my posts. I'm sure stuff I've said have offended other people here.  ;D

Offline FOOTBALLFEVER

  • Emperor Penguin
  • *****
  • Posts: 980
    • View Profile
Re: NDSU a Top 25 team?
« Reply #32 on: September 20, 2016, 05:00:30 PM »
Nick DeLuca will have season ending shoulder surgery. He is expected to return next season and be granted a medical redshirt

Offline go guins

  • Emperor Penguin
  • *****
  • Posts: 2443
    • View Profile
Re: NDSU a Top 25 team?
« Reply #33 on: September 21, 2016, 09:36:55 AM »
Nick DeLuca will have season ending shoulder surgery. He is expected to return next season and be granted a medical redshirt
Too bad.  Clearly the best player in 1AA football.  He was the only thing holding NDSU from being totally "done," right 1AA?  Kidding of course.  I feel sorry when players are hurt, and l hope he recovers fully.  But I'll bet he doesn't come back next year.  This kid is NFL ready and will go with the draft.   
Watching Penquins Football & Basketball since 1967!

Offline IAA Fan

  • Administrator
  • Emperor Penguin
  • *****
  • Posts: 12025
  • Bring Coke back to YSU!!
    • View Profile
    • ysupenguins.com
Re: NDSU a Top 25 team?
« Reply #34 on: September 21, 2016, 11:13:06 AM »
Nick DeLuca will have season ending shoulder surgery. He is expected to return next season and be granted a medical redshirt

You are right Go Guins ...he played the first game so he is not eligible for a medical red-shirt on 2016. I guess they could offer him another year of eligibility, but it is not a common thing. If he graduates this year, he could pick-up the extra year, but my guess would be he would take that at the FBS level. Hoping to get a draft pick is his best option.

With or without him, NDSU is going down, starting this week.

Offline go guins

  • Emperor Penguin
  • *****
  • Posts: 2443
    • View Profile
Re: NDSU a Top 25 team?
« Reply #35 on: September 21, 2016, 02:58:34 PM »


With or without him, NDSU is going down, starting this week.

1AA, willing to part with some $$ on that? We old guys headed to fixed income always looking for a sure thing to supplement our income! Actually I never bet on sports.  I always root my heart NOT my wallet. (BTW, I never heard of a team "going down" on a bye week!) 
Watching Penquins Football & Basketball since 1967!

Offline The YO Show

  • Emperor Penguin
  • *****
  • Posts: 1319
    • View Profile
Re: NDSU a Top 25 team?
« Reply #36 on: September 22, 2016, 01:31:14 PM »
"Every waiver that meets the published criteria is granted, with rare exceptions.

Medical Hardship Requirements

To be eligible for a medical hardship waiver, a student-athlete has to meet the following criteria:

The student-athlete must suffer the injury during one of their four seasons of college competition or during the senior year of high school.
The injury must be incapacitating. That means it must be a season-ending injury.
The injury must occur prior to the start of the second half of the season.
The student-athlete must not have competed in more than 30% of the season or three contests, whichever is greater."

It appears he can get a medical redshirt, as he has only played in three games thus far this season, and 3/11 is less than 3/10 (30%). So it is highly likely he can get another year of eligibility. Whether or not he gets it is another story, but it is a very common thing as state above due to meeting the criteria.

Offline IAA Fan

  • Administrator
  • Emperor Penguin
  • *****
  • Posts: 12025
  • Bring Coke back to YSU!!
    • View Profile
    • ysupenguins.com
Re: NDSU a Top 25 team?
« Reply #37 on: September 22, 2016, 07:39:47 PM »
That is great info Yo Show, they really changed that rule. I think it is just the terminology then; one is a hardship waiver and the other is a red-shirt. DeLuca will qualify for a medical hardship, if approved by the conference, the NCAA will give him an extra year of eligibility. In other words, he is granted a maximum of 6-years to complete his 4-years of eligible participation. Or, (under the old rule) if he has not already taken a red-shirt, he will be granted a 5th-year which is what should happen in this case. A player is normally allowed to take 5-years to play 4-seasons. The year that he does not play is his "red-shirt" year. Again in this case DeLca will be granted an extra year. Many times they do not grant the medical waiver is the player is on scholarship and has already had a red-shirt year. In this case, DeLuca will surely get it because he never took a red-shirt year. Had he not played any of that first game, he would have qualified for a red-shirt year.

In football, the result is the same, but  if a student-athlete competes for even a single play of a contest against another NCAA-sanctioned school, he or she will use a year of competition and not be eligible for a red-shirt year. However, if they compete and subsequently suffer a season-ending injury/illness,
they may be eligible to receive that medical hardship waiver.

Think of it this way. If we bring in kid from HS and we think his injury is minor and it occurred during his senior year, we can ask that he be granted a medical waiver for his frosh year only. Then we can still offer him a red-shirt after that.

Great conversation. Stop in here for the best football info!!!

Offline The YO Show

  • Emperor Penguin
  • *****
  • Posts: 1319
    • View Profile
Re: NDSU a Top 25 team?
« Reply #38 on: September 22, 2016, 09:51:23 PM »
I know its part of why I come here  ;) ;D
I believe you said it one time before, "YSU football fans were some of the smartest college football fans around"

Offline Hammersmith

  • Rock Hopper Penguin
  • *
  • Posts: 2
    • View Profile
Re: NDSU a Top 25 team?
« Reply #39 on: September 25, 2016, 08:23:59 PM »
That is great info Yo Show, they really changed that rule. I think it is just the terminology then; one is a hardship waiver and the other is a red-shirt. DeLuca will qualify for a medical hardship, if approved by the conference, the NCAA will give him an extra year of eligibility. In other words, he is granted a maximum of 6-years to complete his 4-years of eligible participation. Or, (under the old rule) if he has not already taken a red-shirt, he will be granted a 5th-year which is what should happen in this case. A player is normally allowed to take 5-years to play 4-seasons. The year that he does not play is his "red-shirt" year. Again in this case DeLca will be granted an extra year. Many times they do not grant the medical waiver is the player is on scholarship and has already had a red-shirt year. In this case, DeLuca will surely get it because he never took a red-shirt year. Had he not played any of that first game, he would have qualified for a red-shirt year.

In football, the result is the same, but  if a student-athlete competes for even a single play of a contest against another NCAA-sanctioned school, he or she will use a year of competition and not be eligible for a red-shirt year. However, if they compete and subsequently suffer a season-ending injury/illness,
they may be eligible to receive that medical hardship waiver.

Think of it this way. If we bring in kid from HS and we think his injury is minor and it occurred during his senior year, we can ask that he be granted a medical waiver for his frosh year only. Then we can still offer him a red-shirt after that.

Great conversation. Stop in here for the best football info!!!

edit: I reread what you wrote a couple times, and I think we're mostly saying the same thing. I'm leaving my post intact because my first paragraph still applies to what you wrote. The rest of the post is, IMO, a clearer way of stating the rules for those that are confused.



That rule hasn't changed at all in two years, and hasn't changed significantly in many more. There has always been a rule stating at which point a season-ending injury doesn't count against your four years of competition.

What most people overlook is that there is a major difference in how the NCAA handles injured players who redshirted for developmental reasons versus injured players who did not.

The NCAA grants five years to compete in four(Five-Year Rule). That extra year is specifically for injuries or other events outside a student's control. Players and coaches have chosen to often use that extra year for development instead of its intended purpose. The NCAA says, fine, you can do that, but don't come crying to us if you get injured later on; you had an extra year, but you chose to use it already. In those cases, a student ends up with three seasons of competition over five years.

There is a second type of waiver for student-athletes that are injured twice in a career. That waiver gives you six years to compete in four(or six years to compete in three if the player had a developmental redshirt year).

In all of these cases, you have to submit medical records to the NCAA to back up your case.

In this particular case, DeLuca played as a true freshman and never had a redshirt year. The injury occurred in the first half of the season, and he played in less than 30% of the season, or three contests. Because of that, the rules allow him to retroactively declare this season as a medical redshirt year.

A similar case concluded last year with NDSU WR Zach Vraa. He also played as a true freshman and had a season-ending injury very early in a season. He got that year waived as a medical redshirt. A couple years later, he lost a second season to an injury. Because both events were outside his control, he was granted a sixth season in order to complete his four seasons of competition. He ended up the "old man" on the 2015 Bison and was the only member of that team to experience a loss at the end of a collegiate season(vs. EWU in the 2010 quarterfinals as a true freshman).



What is happening with DeLuca is common and likely happens a dozen or more times a season at the FCS level alone. I'd guess at least a hundred or two times across all DI sports each year.
« Last Edit: September 25, 2016, 08:38:33 PM by Hammersmith »

Offline IAA Fan

  • Administrator
  • Emperor Penguin
  • *****
  • Posts: 12025
  • Bring Coke back to YSU!!
    • View Profile
    • ysupenguins.com
Re: NDSU a Top 25 team?
« Reply #40 on: September 25, 2016, 09:56:03 PM »
I think you are right, I am just saying that a waiver is not a red-shirt. A waiver acknowledges that the player did play that season and waves the year off. A red-shirt is a player declaring that the year is one which he is sitting out of football, but does count as one the 5-years a student-athlete has to participate in 4-years worth of football (in this case). A waiver does not count as one of the 5-years that the player has with which to complete 4-years worth of football.

I might be making it more confusing ... hard to say.

God forbid that DeLuca goes into camp next year finds he is not eligible (not going to happen, but just for the heck of it). He could still qualify for a red-shirt; come back and play his 4th-year in 2018. If he were to take a red-shirt right now (instead of a medical waiver) he would have to graduate and take post-grad classes in order to participate next year. So it can be a big difference which of the two that you get. You always want to medical waiver if possible.
« Last Edit: September 25, 2016, 10:01:35 PM by IAA Fan »

Offline ysubigred

  • Emperor Penguin
  • *****
  • Posts: 4111
    • View Profile
Re: NDSU a Top 25 team?
« Reply #41 on: September 26, 2016, 11:25:57 AM »
Holy sh**!!!! Stevie Wonder could see that NDSU is light years ahead of the rest of the FCS  :o

Offline go guins

  • Emperor Penguin
  • *****
  • Posts: 2443
    • View Profile
Re: NDSU a Top 25 team?
« Reply #42 on: September 26, 2016, 11:43:28 AM »
Holy sh**!!!! Stevie Wonder could see that NDSU is light years ahead of the rest of the FCS  :o
Everyone but our fearless leader 1AA (aka 1 "Stevie Wonder" AA)
They remind me of the good old Vince Lombardi teams in GB.  Block better and tackle better and you usually win.  Just good old powder football and solid D.  Worked 50 years ago, works today, will work as long as we play football.
We're always going to have a Wing T, a Wishbone, a West Coast offense or a spread or whatever, but block and tackle never goes out of style.  Our boy 1AA knows that as much as the rest of us, but he got himself in a box and beating them Nov. 5 is the only way out, so I hope he gets out!
The funny thing is, as good as they’ve been, and as good as they are, we had them beat last year until we quit playing.

Watching Penquins Football & Basketball since 1967!

Offline IAA Fan

  • Administrator
  • Emperor Penguin
  • *****
  • Posts: 12025
  • Bring Coke back to YSU!!
    • View Profile
    • ysupenguins.com
Re: NDSU a Top 25 team?
« Reply #43 on: September 26, 2016, 01:06:49 PM »
They are done.

Offline go guins

  • Emperor Penguin
  • *****
  • Posts: 2443
    • View Profile
Re: NDSU a Top 25 team?
« Reply #44 on: September 26, 2016, 01:26:31 PM »
They are done.
That's it, stick to your guns!  I'd expect nothing less. 

I hope those bad boys from ISU don't beat them up too bad.  We'll need them to be high ranked when we kick their butts in the Fargo Dome 11/5! 
Watching Penquins Football & Basketball since 1967!