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YSU Penguin Athletics => YSU Penguin Athletics => Topic started by: Buddy on May 08, 2018, 05:47:26 PM
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https://www.elevenwarriors.com/ohio-state-football/2018/04/92674/joe-burrow-announces-decision-to-leave-ohio-state-as-graduate-transfer
Ysu prospect?
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He doesn't have to sit out a year since he graduated. Wish he was coming but probably no fcs.
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He doesn't have to sit out a year since he graduated. Wish he was coming but probably no fcs.
I thought we had already gotten the ND transfer under similar circumstances. I don't think we need another one and done.
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Very unlikely. He's going to a big program. His dad and brothers played at Nebraska which is rumored to be high on his list. Florida and Texas are also in the running as is Cincinnati because of Fickell
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lol why would he come to YSU?
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He doesn't have to sit out a year since he graduated. Wish he was coming but probably no fcs.
I thought we had already gotten the ND transfer under similar circumstances. I don't think we need another one and done.
He has 2 years of eligibility left. He's a redshirt junior.
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lol why would he come to YSU?
Big recruit at the time for OSU, but obviously can't play at that level. VanGorder was the same at ND. He held for kicks at ND for his career. Some guys can play at 1A, some only 1AA. Some of the hot-shot transfers from 1A can't even play at 1AA. I think our "hit" list is about 50/50. Guys like Avery Moss have been a BIG help, but guys like Luis Irizarry not much at all. I doubt very much Burrow would come to YSU, but right now we have all our eggs in the basket of the ND place kick holder. Kind of scary.
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lol why would he come to YSU?
Big recruit at the time for OSU, but obviously can't play at that level. VanGorder was the same at ND. He held for kicks at ND for his career. Some guys can play at 1A, some only 1AA. Some of the hot-shot transfers from 1A can't even play at 1AA. I think our "hit" list is about 50/50. Guys like Avery Moss have been a BIG help, but guys like Luis Irizarry not much at all. I doubt very much Burrow would come to YSU, but right now we have all our eggs in the basket of the ND place kick holder. Kind of scary.
All reports out of Cbus are that Burrow was actually better in practice than Haskins but the injury set him back and Haskins never looked back. Burrow is going to another big time program. Zero chance he ends up here.
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lol why would he come to YSU?
Big recruit at the time for OSU, but obviously can't play at that level. VanGorder was the same at ND. He held for kicks at ND for his career. Some guys can play at 1A, some only 1AA. Some of the hot-shot transfers from 1A can't even play at 1AA. I think our "hit" list is about 50/50. Guys like Avery Moss have been a BIG help, but guys like Luis Irizarry not much at all. I doubt very much Burrow would come to YSU, but right now we have all our eggs in the basket of the ND place kick holder. Kind of scary.
All reports out of Cbus are that Burrow was actually better in practice than Haskins but the injury set him back and Haskins never looked back. Burrow is going to another big time program. Zero chance he ends up here.
That's fine he doesn't end up at YSU. The question was "lol why would he come to YSU?" My point is, there can be many good reasons. Why is Durkin at YSU and not in the ACC? Why was Louis Irizary at YSU and not OSU, why was Moss @ YSU the list goes on and on, and there are good reasons for many, Moss, criminal charges, Alexander drugs. Hosick injury/ability Derek Rivers, late bloomer. I'm just pointing our there are tones of reasons why good players end up at YSU. When a guy like Carson Wentz goes straight from the MVFC to starting with the Eagles, there is no reason for a good player to avoid 1AA football. Frankly, I think Burrow may be better off at Nebraska than YSU if he doesn't think he can win the job from VanGorder.
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Burrow was Mr football in Ohio in 2014. Last year he was the #2 qb until he got hurt. He looked better than Haskins coming out of the spring game. He's Better than anyone YSU has had since Cliff Stoudt. I won't be surprised if he's on an NFL roster in the near future.
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lol why would he come to YSU?
Big recruit at the time for OSU, but obviously can't play at that level. VanGorder was the same at ND. He held for kicks at ND for his career. Some guys can play at 1A, some only 1AA. Some of the hot-shot transfers from 1A can't even play at 1AA. I think our "hit" list is about 50/50. Guys like Avery Moss have been a BIG help, but guys like Luis Irizarry not much at all. I doubt very much Burrow would come to YSU, but right now we have all our eggs in the basket of the ND place kick holder. Kind of scary.
All reports out of Cbus are that Burrow was actually better in practice than Haskins but the injury set him back and Haskins never looked back. Burrow is going to another big time program. Zero chance he ends up here.
That's fine he doesn't end up at YSU. The question was "lol why would he come to YSU?" My point is, there can be many good reasons. Why is Durkin at YSU and not in the ACC? Why was Louis Irizary at YSU and not OSU, why was Moss @ YSU the list goes on and on, and there are good reasons for many, Moss, criminal charges, Alexander drugs. Hosick injury/ability Derek Rivers, late bloomer. I'm just pointing our there are tones of reasons why good players end up at YSU. When a guy like Carson Wentz goes straight from the MVFC to starting with the Eagles, there is no reason for a good player to avoid 1AA football. Frankly, I think Burrow may be better off at Nebraska than YSU if he doesn't think he can win the job from VanGorder.
He's a really good QB but doesn't fit into Urban's ideal QB needs. Sorry but even thinking he would go to YSU is crazy. He's going to another big program and probably will start immediately. Vangorder wasn't even that good coming out of high school. Not sure you can even compare the 2.
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Burrow was Mr football in Ohio in 2014. Last year he was the #2 qb until he got hurt. He looked better than Haskins coming out of the spring game. He's Better than anyone YSU has had since Cliff Stoudt. I won't be surprised if he's on an NFL roster in the near future.
I agree.
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I see your point but Wentz is not a good example. The team owners/coach made the decision to build a team around a guy with medium ability in Wentz (same thing in college) ...he is a system guy. If someone is willing to build a team of professionals around us, anyone of us (assuming some ability)can play in the NFL as well. We all saw what a clear back-up was able to do to that team, with some minor tweaking of the offense and better individual ability. Far out perform Wentz and win the super bowl.
NFL teams are always going to drawn to the college players with more proven talent. You always want the guys that played against the best. I am not so certain that I would like YSU ball with more NFL caliber players. Too much of the emphasis will fall on recruiting. High-risk or marginal young guys will have to go elsewhere. No Derek Rivers, or Ron Jaworski. Both marginal guys brought in by coaches with the idea that they may be something some day and willing to change offenses and defense to get it. NFL owners and fans are not going to be that patient.
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I see your point but Wentz is not a good example. The team owners/coach made the decision to build a team around a guy with medium ability in Wentz (same thing in college) ...he is a system guy. If someone is willing to build a team of professionals around us, anyone of us (assuming some ability)can play in the NFL as well. We all saw what a clear back-up was able to do to that team, with some minor tweaking of the offense and better individual ability. Far out perform Wentz and win the super bowl.
NFL teams are always going to drawn to the college players with more proven talent. You always want the guys that played against the best. I am not so certain that I would like YSU ball with more NFL caliber players. Too much of the emphasis will fall on recruiting. High-risk or marginal young guys will have to go elsewhere. No Derek Rivers, or Ron Jaworski. Both marginal guys brought in by coaches with the idea that they may be something some day and willing to change offenses and defense to get it. NFL owners and fans are not going to be that patient.
"If someone is willing to build a team of professionals around us, anyone of us (assuming some ability)can play in the NFL as well. "
Do you seriously believe that? Actually I think you must be joking! First of all, I think you seriously underrate Carson Wentz, second, you FAR underestimate the talent needed to play QB in the top level.
"We all saw what a clear back-up was able to do" Just to be clear, Foles was a former #1 QB and Pro Bowl player, not a "clear back up"
"Far out perform Wentz and win the super bowl." That clearly ISN'T true Foles biggest play in the super bowl was a catch, not a pass. If Brady CATCHES his pass and Foles doesn't, NE wins and Phil. loses. Foles was adequate as the back up QB, but The SB run was all about the Philly D.
Your logic is faulty regarding pro talent players. You are not creating any more positions. If pro talent players come to YSU than they don't go to OSU. That means move "lesser" talented player to OSU. Nobody gets squeezed out, there are the same number of positions available.
"Derek Rivers, or Ron Jaworski. Both marginal guys" That is blatantly unfair to two of our best ever. They were definitely "late developers" but NOT "marginal guys." Many great players develop late, especially QBs. What do Frank Ryan, the last QB to win a championship in Cleveland, and Tom Brady have in common? They couldn't win the starting job in college! And don't forget two teams including the Steelers cut Johnny Unitas! Being a late developer doesn't make you a marginal guy!
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I see your point but Wentz is not a good example. The team owners/coach made the decision to build a team around a guy with medium ability in Wentz (same thing in college) ...he is a system guy. If someone is willing to build a team of professionals around us, anyone of us (assuming some ability)can play in the NFL as well. We all saw what a clear back-up was able to do to that team, with some minor tweaking of the offense and better individual ability. Far out perform Wentz and win the super bowl.
NFL teams are always going to drawn to the college players with more proven talent. You always want the guys that played against the best. I am not so certain that I would like YSU ball with more NFL caliber players. Too much of the emphasis will fall on recruiting. High-risk or marginal young guys will have to go elsewhere. No Derek Rivers, or Ron Jaworski. Both marginal guys brought in by coaches with the idea that they may be something some day and willing to change offenses and defense to get it. NFL owners and fans are not going to be that patient.
"If someone is willing to build a team of professionals around us, anyone of us (assuming some ability)can play in the NFL as well. "
Do you seriously believe that? Actually I think you must be joking! First of all, I think you seriously underrate Carson Wentz, second, you FAR underestimate the talent needed to play QB in the top level.
"We all saw what a clear back-up was able to do" Just to be clear, Foles was a former #1 QB and Pro Bowl player, not a "clear back up"
"Far out perform Wentz and win the super bowl." That clearly ISN'T true Foles biggest play in the super bowl was a catch, not a pass. If Brady CATCHES his pass and Foles doesn't, NE wins and Phil. loses. Foles was adequate as the back up QB, but The SB run was all about the Philly D.
Your logic is faulty regarding pro talent players. You are not creating any more positions. If pro talent players come to YSU than they don't go to OSU. That means move "lesser" talented player to OSU. Nobody gets squeezed out, there are the same number of positions available.
"Derek Rivers, or Ron Jaworski. Both marginal guys" That is blatantly unfair to two of our best ever. They were definitely "late developers" but NOT "marginal guys." Many great players develop late, especially QBs. What do Frank Ryan, the last QB to win a championship in Cleveland, and Tom Brady have in common? They couldn't win the starting job in college! And don't forget two teams including the Steelers cut Johnny Unitas! Being a late developer doesn't make you a marginal guy!
Foles was clearly the back-up to Wentz
I do not underestimate Wentz. Far too many people over-estimate him. He was not even the best QB at our level. He does not stay with the play long enough to make something "unscheduled" happen. This is never going to change and the trademark of a system QB. Never going to have that extra-step to get a more acurate release. Never sees anything else going on once the play is chosen.
At the time we took Jaws and Rivers, they were marginal players. Had everyone known that Jaws was going to be an NFL great QB, he would not have been marginal and never played Small College ball. Neither would Rivers. It took a couple of coaches to see soemthing in them, reach out and have faith. Then again, both Dike and Wolf reached out and took chances unsuccessfully many more times than they selected their future NFL greats.
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1AA you drive me crazy!
"He was not even the best QB at our level. He does not stay with the play long enough to make something "unscheduled" happen. This is never going to change and the trademark of a system QB."
That is exactly the OPPOSITE of a system QB. The system QB runs the system, hence the name "system QB"
You describe Wentz and one of these free lance kind of guys and then call him a system guy. IMO, he is neither. He runs the pay and when the play breaks down he has that "slip and slide" ability like Brady, to move and make something happen. Not a runner, but a play maker.
Your use of marginal is far different than mine. Webster says: close to the lower limit of qualification, acceptability, or function : barely exceeding the minimum requirements a semiliterate person of marginal ability
Whatever you can say, Rivers and Jaws they were not of "marginal ability!" In the assessment of recruiters they may have had unrecognized ability , but it was NOT marginal ability. Many recruiters are wrong! Unrecognized talent is NOT the same as marginal talent!
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Well, as to Wentz ...no thank you. To even put him on the same plan of existence as Brady is an insult to Brady. He never makes things happen. Foles did and this why they advanced and won the super-bowl. A system (to me) is one where anyone can step in and have a reasonable chance at success (both NDSU and YSU<under our former OC> run "systems". This is why we can bring in Mays and he performs well, despite a limited playbook & even less experience.
99% of all HS players (seniors) are marginal (at best) college DI players. The key is being able to read that "Crystal Ball" for when they are college Juniors and Seniors. This is why you want "like" kids From Massilon Washington instead of Perry, or Canton McKinley instead of Louisville, etc.. It is not to say that these other schools don't have solid players, but the top player at one chooses his college, the other hopes to play DI somewhere and get some scholarship money. Again Beede hoped Jaws would work-out & picked up a couple of receivers that could catch a 91MPH fast-ball style passer like Jaws. Bo and Wolf tried to beef up the DL to giver Rivers a chance to get that penetration. Bo even brought in another stud for the other side. Same applies to the NFL; which is why you want a player from Michigan ... over a player from N Dakota State.
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Wow. I am sorry I posted this. I was just trying to get a football conversation going.
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Uhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh
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Well, as to Wentz ...no thank you. To even put him on the same plan of existence as Brady is an insult to Brady. He never makes things happen. Foles did and this why they advanced and won the super-bowl. A system (to me) is one where anyone can step in and have a reasonable chance at success (both NDSU and YSU<under our former OC> run "systems". This is why we can bring in Mays and he performs well, despite a limited playbook & even less experience.
99% of all HS players (seniors) are marginal (at best) college DI players. The key is being able to read that "Crystal Ball" for when they are college Juniors and Seniors. This is why you want "like" kids From Massilon Washington instead of Perry, or Canton McKinley instead of Louisville, etc.. It is not to say that these other schools don't have solid players, but the top player at one chooses his college, the other hopes to play DI somewhere and get some scholarship money. Again Beede hoped Jaws would work-out & picked up a couple of receivers that could catch a 91MPH fast-ball style passer like Jaws. Bo and Wolf tried to beef up the DL to giver Rivers a chance to get that penetration. Bo even brought in another stud for the other side. Same applies to the NFL; which is why you want a player from Michigan ... over a player from N Dakota State.
"To even put him on the same plan of existence as Brady is an insult to Brady."
While Wentz "exists" in the same world as Brady, I would certainly agree Carson isn't remotely comparable to Brady, at least yet.
"99% of all HS players (seniors) are marginal (at best) college DI players."
Generally I would agree here too, but I think you would be better off using "average" rather than "marginal" Approx. 1% of HS football players in Ohio play FBS football, and not all are "marginal" some are, some are average and some are above average and outstanding.
I don't and I don't think the NFL "prefers" players from Michigan over NDSU. I'll bet you the success/failure rate of draft choices by draft position is at least as good for smaller schools as it is for the power 5 conference schools.
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Big recruit at the time for OSU, but obviously can't play at that level. VanGorder was the same at ND.
Will find out in the next 2 years if he can play at that level. Can't compare him to VanGorder, because VanGorder never took a snap at ND. Burrow was JT's primary backup in 16, and completed 22 of 28 passes at mop up time in 6 games. Last season he was 7 of 11 in 4 games, after Haskins moved ahead of him when he broke his hand.
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Big recruit at the time for OSU, but obviously can't play at that level. VanGorder was the same at ND.
Will find out in the next 2 years if he can play at that level. Can't compare him to VanGorder, because VanGorder never took a snap at ND. Burrow was JT's primary backup in 16, and completed 22 of 28 passes at mop up time in 6 games. Last season he was 7 of 11 in 4 games, after Haskins moved ahead of him when he broke his hand.
I'm sorry, but I don't see any difference in Burrow's 26 "mop up" passes and VanGorder's dozens of snaps (not -0- as you note) at ND. Neither mean a damn thing. They are equal in assessing the player, as they contribute nothing.
We'll see with Monty at YSU and maybe Burrow at LSU?
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Big recruit at the time for OSU, but obviously can't play at that level. VanGorder was the same at ND.
Will find out in the next 2 years if he can play at that level. Can't compare him to VanGorder, because VanGorder never took a snap at ND. Burrow was JT's primary backup in 16, and completed 22 of 28 passes at mop up time in 6 games. Last season he was 7 of 11 in 4 games, after Haskins moved ahead of him when he broke his hand.
I'm sorry, but I don't see any difference in Burrow's 26 "mop up" passes and VanGorder's dozens of snaps (not -0- as you note) at ND. Neither mean a damn thing. They are equal in assessing the player, as they contribute nothing.
We'll see with Monty at YSU and maybe Burrow at LSU?
Dozens of snaps as a holder. MVG compiled no statistics as a QB at Notre Dame. Never threw a pass. Never ran the ball. His bio says he played in one game as a reserve QB in 2016. Maybe he handed off a few times or was sent in to take a knee at the end of a game.
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Big recruit at the time for OSU, but obviously can't play at that level. VanGorder was the same at ND.
Will find out in the next 2 years if he can play at that level. Can't compare him to VanGorder, because VanGorder never took a snap at ND. Burrow was JT's primary backup in 16, and completed 22 of 28 passes at mop up time in 6 games. Last season he was 7 of 11 in 4 games, after Haskins moved ahead of him when he broke his hand.
I'm sorry, but I don't see any difference in Burrow's 26 "mop up" passes and VanGorder's dozens of snaps (not -0- as you note) at ND. Neither mean a damn thing. They are equal in assessing the player, as they contribute nothing.
We'll see with Monty at YSU and maybe Burrow at LSU?
(https://i2.wp.com/gifrific.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/10/Donald-Trump-Confused-Face-2015-Republican-Debate.gif)
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It's a wonder why many have left this board... lol.
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Jeaux Burreaux