How good is the MVFC

[ysubigred]

"IF" the MVFC was getting the full complement of schollies (FBS) I'd say this conference would not be too far behind the 

[Penguin Nation]

Secondly, talk said well, we had 2 coach H teams (arguably 3) that deserved the post-season. We have had no coach W teams that deserved consideration.

In the final 2013 Sports Network poll, YSU was ranked 18th.

These at-large bids were ranked lower:  Samford (19), S Utah (21), and SC State (25)

It appears that Samford was ranked lower than YSU not just on the Sports Network poll, but also the actual SRS, and yet still received an at-large bid over YSU:

http://www.championshipsubdivision.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=38125

Some concerns expressed with the SRS:

http://www.championshipsubdivision.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=38146

Does the playoff selection committee have a bias toward smaller schools and smaller conferences?   I would say yes.  I'm not claiming that the YSU FB program would have gone deep in the post-season, or even that it is not a disappointment considering all of the resources it has.  I'm just saying there appears to be irregularities in the selection process resulting in a selection bias by the committee.

[penguinpower]

Secondly, talk said well, we had 2 coach H teams (arguably 3) that deserved the post-season. We have had no coach W teams that deserved consideration.

In the final 2013 Sports Network poll, YSU was ranked 18th.

These at-large bids were ranked lower:  Samford (19), S Utah (21), and SC State (25)

It appears that Samford was ranked lower than YSU not just on the Sports Network poll, but also the actual SRS, and yet still received an at-large bid over YSU:

http://www.championshipsubdivision.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=38125

Some concerns expressed with the SRS:

http://www.championshipsubdivision.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=38146

Does the playoff selection committee have a bias toward smaller schools and smaller conferences?   I would say yes.  I'm not claiming that the YSU FB program would have gone deep in the post-season, or even that it is not a disappointment considering all of the resources it has.  I'm just saying there appears to be irregularities in the selection process resulting in a selection bias by the committee.

This is an excellent post.  I sent Viverito an email last year about this very issue and she was just as baffled. I speculate that some of the voters just don't like us.  Maybe it has to do with Tressel/ Issac stuff....but we were also better than Sam Houston State last year and had a better record. 

In years past when Heacock's teams were left out.........the same thing happened.  One time they said it was not enough D1 wins, then next year we were left out we were told that we went 2-3 or 0-3 in games at the end of the season.  All arbitrary and that is why I disagree that how you finish the year....it doesn't matter. 8 wins is 8 wins.  The MVFC schedule for us last year was weighted heavy at the end.  Not our fault.  We may have been able to beat UNI if we had a better schedule.  The timing was not good for us. 

At the end of the day the only time we got in the playoffs since Tressel left is when we won the conference outright and that was in 2006.  It didn't matter if we shared the league title and that is why conference championships mean nothing to me.....doesn't translate into playoff births.    We won the title in 1997 but we didn't win the conference.  The voting must be standardized.  The SRS calculation is unknown.  It has not been published.  I have been looking for the equation.  More backroom deals.

[IAA Fan]

In early Heacock HC years, the NCAA did not have clear rules, as the objective was how to make the division appear more positive and remain profitable. Teams refused to pay the fees. YSU paid well and had good crowds ...the results were more times selected and awarded home games. The fact that we played well made it even better.

However, let's face it ...teams do not have the chance to be so dominant without some "help" 

Georgia Southern
Marshall
YSU
Appy State
ND State

and too a lesser degree Eastern Kentucky have all benefited from a more-than-generous amount of light being shed upon them by the NCAA.

Again, you cannot take only the nations perceived top teams and give them spots. If no one from the Ohio Valley Conference made the field, then athletes would not attend those schools and the conference would fold. Eventually so would the sub-division. If you want to grow the division, you need to spread the "seeds". Clearly the NCAA has recognized peoples concerns in the expansion of the play-off field.

[nova75]

In the 10 years I have been on this board, this is officially the earliest you guys have ever started b****ing about the lack of respect for the conference and the anti-YSU conspiracy. I usually have to wait til November. Thanks! 

[penguinpower]

In the 10 years I have been on this board, this is officially the earliest you guys have ever started b****ing about the lack of respect for the conference and the anti-YSU conspiracy. I usually have to wait til November. Thanks! 

The CAA has  now become the little sisters of the poor with several (6 the last I checked) losses to NEC and Patriot league conference members.  They essentially have 2 good teams which is Villanova and UNH while the MVFC has gone 23-1 in out of conference play with the single loss by 7 points to Montara. Yet the boobs over at the sports network are churning out articles that are titled "CAA football has a top 25 feel" and making statements such as "CAA football is the deepest conference in the FCS".  Freaking Albany is in the top half this year and they have been full schedule for maybe a year. Wow!  The other issue is that the CAA has no room to schedule MVFC or other power conference teams because the conference is "so big" yet they always seem to find a way to fit in an NEC team or a Patsy team.  Interesting to say the least.  TSN voters had 11 points for St. Francis. Unfortunately for us the FCS is an afterthought to 95% of the Walmartians  that make up the US and so the voters and NCAA have no accountability in showing how teams are selected.   What is really probably happening in the voters look at the TSN poll and assume everyone knows what they are talking about and the only have to evaluate the bubble teams.  They know they can be as arbitrary as they want and there will be no consequences.   Freaking Butler, Samford and SHSU were selected over YSU last year. You can't tell me that this is an anomaly.  This happens all the time. Someone needs to pay the price for this travesty.   What is is the drinking water in Eastern Pa?  How could TSN even make those statements when the record clearly states otherwise?   Care to answer that?

[HappyPenguin]

In the 10 years I have been on this board, this is officially the earliest you guys have ever started b****ing about the lack of respect for the conference and the anti-YSU conspiracy. I usually have to wait til November. Thanks! 

Really! Let's let Wolf blow a game by poor clock management and no second half adjustments before we command respect.

[YSUFANSINCE1990]

 In 2011 YSU didn't make the playoffs because they lost to the worst team in the league at home in the season finale, didn't deserve to make the playoffs.  Last year lost to an injury depleted Northern Iowa team, they lost the final two games at home by a combined 47 points!!!  Does that sound like a playoff team to you?

There is no conspiracy or dislike for YSU.  Also add to the fact that if YSU keeps playing three scrimmages in September and not playing quality competition they are not going to get in as a bubble team.  Northern Iowa at 7-5 was more worthy last year.  Two of their losses to FBS teams, and they beat YSU.

As far back as Heacock's first year, there was a cry of conspiracy, yet, he lost at home to Western Kentucky with a playoff berth on the line, thats why YSU didn't make it.

We just haven't been good enough.   One more reason YSU didn't get in last year, where was there a quality win?   Maybe Southern Illinois, but they didn't beat a team that went to the playoffs.

[Wick250]

This playoff debate really contains two issues that should be separated.  First, was YSU cheated out of a berth last season?  Second, is the NCAA selection process fair or biased?

Let's dispose of the first issue quickly.  By last Thanksgiving weekend, we were not a playoff caliber team.  It was not just the three consecutive losses but also how they happened.  The team flat out quit against SDSU.  Also, we had no quarterback with both Hess and Nania down.

The scandal revolves around the second issue; namely, the clandestine FCS selection process.  The numerical ratings that FBS used to position teams for bowl games may or may not have been valid, but it was transparent.  The table was published weekly, and each team knew where they stood.  I had hoped that the FCS committee would have done the same thing last season.  They had promised to use a formula based upon strength of schedule.  Yet they refused to release that table DURING the season.  Then they awarded multiple bids to weak conferences while offering only two to the MFVC.  Southern Illinois or Northern Iowa should have replaced us in the tournament.  The best conference deserved at least three bids regardless of records.  Just as heavyweight basketball conferences place multiple teams into the NCAA tournament even though some of those teams are barely over .500.

To have any credibility and to remove all talk of conspiracy, the FCS selection committee must release their internal numbers periodically during the season, say after the last weeks of September and October.  Until they become transparent, they are open to charges of being corrupt.

[Penguin Nation]

So YSU was not good enough to make the 2013 post-season.....but teams with lower SRS (as well as lower ranking in other polls) were good enough? 

From what I've read, the SRS does not penalize teams for late season losses.  It shouldn't, because if it did it would be a(nother) de facto  penalty for membership in a strong conference.  If the selection committee truly penalizes teams for end of the season skids, than maybe NDSU should have a bye week the last week.  Maybe the MVFC should allow OOC opponents to finish the season. 

Again...YSU's last 3 games were against teams ranked #1 (also national champions ), #14, and UNI who was ranked two weeks before we played them.  That same 2013 UNI team defeated Iowa State, crushed McNeese (who was ranked 9th), and finished the season with three straight wins.  All 5 UNI losses were in the #1 FCS conference....and three of the games went to OT...two of them double OT...and they lost to the national champs by one point.

McNeese took a much worse beating from UNI and made the playoffs (YSU lost by 2....McNeese lost by 35 points).

How would at-large teams like TN State or Jacksonville State have fared versus those three teams?  I'm pretty sure it would have been an 0-3 curb-stomping for all three games.

Here's an AGS thread about the SRS:

http://www.anygivensaturday.com/showthread.php?148321-SRS-released


I agree with the posters...the SRS produces results that wildly vary from nearly all other polls...including Massey which is a composite of polls.  The SRS is claimed to factor in SOS....but if it does it must be given little weight.

BTW....it is not a conspiracy if it is a proven fact.  A lower SRS team (Samford) made the 2013 post-season over a higher ranked team (YSU).

I agree with Wick.  The final week (or even two weeks), every team should know the scenarios that exclude them or qualify them.  There should be zero mystery after all of the scores are in on the final Saturday of regular season.  The selection show should simply reveal the pairings, seeds, and venues.

[Penguin Nation]

I would add that I sense that the lack of results that the Wolf has produced, and overall frustration with the program, has led to a negativity regarding the program.....and a "screw 'em they deserve nothing" attitude.

I get it.  As a life long fan I too am frustrated.  But........lower ranked teams....who've also played bad games....should not be leapfrogging higher ranked teams in the post-season selection process.

[HappyPenguin]

I would add that I sense that the lack of results that the Wolf has produced, and overall frustration with the program, has led to a negativity regarding the program.....and a "screw 'em they deserve nothing" attitude.

I get it.  As a life long fan I too am frustrated.  But........lower ranked teams....who've also played bad games....should not be leapfrogging higher ranked teams in the post-season selection process.

This sums up my feelings exactly. Well put

[penguinpower]

So YSU was not good enough to make the 2013 post-season.....but teams with lower SRS (as well as lower ranking in other polls) were good enough? 

From what I've read, the SRS does not penalize teams for late season losses.  It shouldn't, because if it did it would be a(nother) de facto  penalty for membership in a strong conference.  If the selection committee truly penalizes teams for end of the season skids, than maybe NDSU should have a bye week the last week.  Maybe the MVFC should allow OOC opponents to finish the season. 

Again...YSU's last 3 games were against teams ranked #1 (also national champions ), #14, and UNI who was ranked two weeks before we played them.  That same 2013 UNI team defeated Iowa State, crushed McNeese (who was ranked 9th), and finished the season with three straight wins.  All 5 UNI losses were in the #1 FCS conference....and three of the games went to OT...two of them double OT...and they lost to the national champs by one point.

McNeese took a much worse beating from UNI and made the playoffs (YSU lost by 2....McNeese lost by 35 points).

How would at-large teams like TN State or Jacksonville State have fared versus those three teams?  I'm pretty sure it would have been an 0-3 curb-stomping for all three games.

Here's an AGS thread about the SRS:

http://www.anygivensaturday.com/showthread.php?148321-SRS-released


I agree with the posters...the SRS produces results that wildly vary from nearly all other polls...including Massey which is a composite of polls.  The SRS is claimed to factor in SOS....but if it does it must be given little weight.

BTW....it is not a conspiracy if it is a proven fact.  A lower SRS team (Samford) made the 2013 post-season over a higher ranked team (YSU).

I agree with Wick.  The final week (or even two weeks), every team should know the scenarios that exclude them or qualify them.  There should be zero mystery after all of the scores are in on the final Saturday of regular season.  The selection show should simply reveal the pairings, seeds, and venues.

Excellent Post!

[ysubigred]

  I'm beating a dead horse here, but it won't get fixed till they stop giving auto bids and at-large bias bids. The best 16-24 teams period should play in the playoffs selected by polls-computer-strength of schedule-W/L record and conference strength. The human eye test and committee votes are way to bias. All conference champs can be seeds or just rewarded by their respective conference for a job well done  So be it if 10 of the best 24 teams come from one conference... That will force all the other dead beat conferences who want to settle it on the field to step it up.

Rant over,,,, YBR out!

[Penguin Nation]

Why did the NCAA take down the 2013 FCS SRS?


http://www.ncaa.com/rankings/football/fcs/fcs-srs-poll